Meaning Change[]
So this type is going to need a bit of a rework. There's been a lot of confusion between this type and utsudere, where it was previously described that utsudere "has a reason" for being sad while shundere doesn't and that was the only difference, but this doesn't actually appear to be true.
- This movie website describes it as "when the person you like doesn't care you get sad as in "shun..." but when the other person says it's okay you get dere"
- This Japanese wiki page says "Shundere is a character that is a combination of a personality that gets sad when someone doesn't pay attention to you, saying Shun or Shun (´･ω･｀), and a personality that is dere dere towards them."
- One of the examples this page gives is the character Holo from Spice & Wolf. She asks her love interest to get sweets for her and when he says no she gets all sad until he buys them for her.
So it appears to be sort of an inverse of a "tsunshun", where instead of getting sad because you are the one being "tsun" you get sad because your love interest is. Honestly this kind of makes more sense anyways because "being sad all the time" is just what depression is, so having two depression types for mild and severe is a little confusing.
This type will be rewritten to be characters who get temporarily sad because of their love interest and all characters who are just sad all the time because they're depressed in general should be moved to utsudere.
BlackDragon 06:48, 16 January 2024 (UTC)
It makes total sense! Actually, I'm glad the meaning is different, a lot of people were criticising shundere because it treated depression lightly. Utsudere would need some changes as well, then.
What should we do? Move all characters to utsudere or you think we can accept this dere type as a Western variation? I would be okay with both solutions, but I think we should mention in shundere how for a long time in the West it was known with a different meaning.
♡.:Eira:. ✧
✧ Talk✽ 08:50, 16 January 2024 (UTC)
Yeah, I was wondering about that. I was considering making a Western version at first because it is a fairly big change, but thinking more about it since there's already a similar type that we can move the characters to (unlike is the case with the Western Maya, Doro and Aho) it's probably better to just merge the type with Utsudere. I'll try to go through and rewrite the Utsudere page tonight so it covers both types and then start working on a new Shundere.
I can add a small section about the incorrect Western definition in Shundere and just link to the Utsudere page.